home
***
CD-ROM
|
disk
|
FTP
|
other
***
search
/
Hackers Underworld 2: Forbidden Knowledge
/
Hackers Underworld 2: Forbidden Knowledge.iso
/
OCCULT
/
FASCIST.SET
< prev
next >
Wrap
Text File
|
1993-04-09
|
26KB
|
493 lines
Newsgroups: alt.magick
Subject: Facism within the Temple of Set? A long look at the accusations.
Summary:
Expires:
References:
Sender:
Followup-To:
Distribution:
Organization: The Friends of Loki Society
Keywords:
Note: I (Grendel Grettisson) did not write this. I am unaware of who the
author is. Don't attribute this to me though.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
I have not seen any of the 1990 correspondence between Tim Maroney and Dr.
Aquino, nor do I have any interest in seeing it. I will try to avoid
commenting on the alleged abuses or failings of language, protocol, or
courtesy from either side within that correspondence.
(For those who may need help identifying this message thread, Diane has
asked some specific questions concerning Tim Maroney's 11/90 "The Nazi
Trapezoid" [which purports to identify leanings toward Nazi sympathy
within the Temple of Set] and Dr. Aquino's response to same. This is my
response, hoping to answer those questions. Both original documents have
been re-posted in this echo in the past month, and both are available in
the "TOS" file section of Northern Lights BBS and in file sections of
various other BBS nodes.)
I'm also going to try to avoid commenting on the personal comments made by
anyone concerning anyone else anywhere in this thread -- I find only two
justifications for my spending so much time this week examining the
documents and comments concerning same, material which is at best
peripheral to my own personal Xeper:
a) You have indicated that you want to be able to present a clear argument
that Satanism is not inherently fascist, and you want my assistance in
proving that the Temple of Set is not fascist, so you can use it to
support your argument. I think this is a worthy project.
b) If the Temple presents me with another opportunity to exercise my
Toastmasters training on their behalf, and if the same sorts of questions
are asked of me (as they likely will be if your activities garner
publicity), I had better be prepared.
So I'm going to concentrate strictly on the question of fascism, the
supposed appearance of same, and the actuality of non-fascism.
Before I start, a reminder: The following statements are my personal
descriptions of the positions and points of view of Setians, each of them
an individual. The Temple of Set as an organization has no opinion or
point of view of its own concerning fascism -- that topic is simply
outside the Temple's realm of concern. To my knowledge there has never
been a formal policy made nor formal discussion concerning the issues you
ask about. Any opinion, position, or point of view is that of
individuals, not of the organization.
-----
In your 1/25 post to me, you suggest that the question, "What does Aquino
agree with and disagree with about Nazi ideology (repeat: Nazi *ideology*,
not just Nazi practices)?" is a reasonable question. I would agree. You go
on to wonder why Dr. Aquino "felt he had to duck this question."
I find he answered several elements of the question.
However, those answers may have been too general to answer the questions you
have.
In Dr. Aquino's 11/14/90 response, as quoted in part 2 of your 1/25 post
to me, Dr. Aquino says, "I have always deplored its [Naziism's] premises,
policies, and activities which resulted in savagery and misery to a great
many people." He deplores its premises (ideology) and its policies
(practices) which result in savagery and misery.
What are the specifics not covered in that statement that you need
clarification on? What are the elements of Nazi ideology that concern you
which did not "result in savagery and misery to a great many people"?
For those who may not know the precise definitions, my dictionary defines
ideology as: "1: visionary theorizing. 2a: a systematic body of concepts,
esp. about human life or culture. 2b: a manner or the content of thinking
characteristic of an individual, group, or culture. 2c: the integrated
assertions, theories, and aims that constitute a sociopolitical program."
Each of the variations of definition 2 apply to this
discussion.
My dictionary defines Naziism as, "the body of political and economic
doctrines held and put into effect by the National Socialist German
Workers' party in the Third German Reich including the totalitarian
principle of government, state control of all industry, predominance of
groups assumed to be racially superior, and supremacy of the fuhrer."
I'm not Dr. Aquino, but I've been reading his works for well over a decade
now, and I've heard some of his discussions on these and related topics,
and I believe I can accurately state the following:
1) Dr. Aquino disagrees with the Nazi ideology of the totalitarian
principle of government. While he recognizes that there are problems in
every form of democracy used to date, democracy in general results in
better governments and better organizations than does totalitarianism.
In evidence of this, I point to the organization of the Temple of Set (his
design), where a) there are multiple checks and balances designed to
ensure that no single person wields totalitarian power, b) all members of
the Priesthood have an equal vote concerning the bylaws of the
organization, and c) a democratic vote of the Council of Nine is powerful
enough to remove any officer from power and to expel any member from the
organization, including the High Priest.
2) Dr. Aquino disagrees with the Nazi ideology of the state control of all
industry. While Dr. Aquino is certainly no captain of industry (he prefers
to earn his livelihood within academia), I've never heard him express any
dissatisfaction with capitalism or the free market system, other than the
generally recognized fact that people can be financially hurt in a
non-socialist state.
Instead of arguing for a socialist state, which would be the case if he
supported this Nazi ideology, Dr. Aquino instead argues that Black
Magicians should be able to successfully make their own way in a
capitalist society.
3) Dr. Aquino disagrees with the Nazi ideology of the predominance of
groups assumed to be racially superior. I have always seen Dr. Aquino
treat people of various races as comparative equals, judging people not by
race, but by personal qualities under the control of the individual (their
education, their application of their native intelligence, their
sociability, their honor, their dedication, etc).
4) Dr. Aquino disagrees with the Nazi ideology of the supremacy of the
fuhrer. There were some things that Hitler said or wrote which are worth
studying, but there were also many, many things said, written, and done by
Hitler which are reprehensible. Setians are fond of saying they worship
none but their own higher Selves. Dr. Aquino lives that ideal.
Those are the four ideologies of Naziism listed in my dictionary. If there
are other ideologies you wonder about, you'll need to ask about them
specifically.
Since Naziism and fascism are so closely related, and since Dr. Aquino and
the Temple of Set have been accused of being fascist, let me explore that
topic also.
Fascism -- 1: a political philosophy, movement, or regime that exalts
nation and race above the individual, and that stands for a centralized
autocratic government headed by a dictatorial leader, severe economic and
social regimentation, and forcible suppression of opposition. 2: a
tendency toward or actual exercise of strong autocratic or dictatorial
control.
1) Dr. Aquino believes in and exalts the individual over the nation and
race. This is central to the concept of Xeper and the Left Hand Path.
This concept is even more important than the Temple of Set -- as High
Priest he as seen many individual initiates pleasantly leave the Temple of
Set for reasons of their own, and has later welcomed back several of those
with open arms. Such is not the behavior of a fascist.
2) Dr. Aquino does not believe in a centralized autocratic government
headed by a dictatorial leader. He believes in the American form of
democracy (while admitting that it has its problems), and he has designed
the Temple's organization and bylaws to pre